Ipak izglasana zabrana benzinaca i dizelaša
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Re: Ipak izglasana zabrana benzinaca i dizelaša
Popizdim kad se isprazni mobitel, a nemas gdje napuniti, a kamoli auto.veber wrote:jebote nisi moderan ko marc.dijagram wrote:jos o auticima, do kad vise.
evo i ja cu, prekjucer produzio registraciju.
ide na dizel i nije bijeli ko crvenkov
malo sam ga omuljao kod city centra i dok se susio maznuo dvije lavazze
stize proljece uskoro cu ljetne gume kupiti
tako, mali doprinos temi:)
hiti dizel i kupi strujića.
ti sa svojim autom odeš do splita i natrag i još posjetiš žensku u makarskoj, popiješ kavu s debom i moraš tankati.
marc je do tada filao auto 5×.
spikao je s imenjakom Proust di su mu nestali sati
i tako to. hoće kada ostariš pa ti na platzu svakaj uvale.
ionako nosi lakosta majice.
Dizel je zakon, za muzjake, struja je za transrodne, zelene, wokiste, prcka, marcela i slicne:)
dijagram- Posts : 18695
2015-08-09
Re: Ipak izglasana zabrana benzinaca i dizelaša
marcellus wrote:
kuća majka
stanovi i centri gradova i u europi postaju što su u SAD oduvijek bili, "inner city"
imigranti i crazy cat ladies
Najbolje je u biti imati i jedno i drugo, život u gradu je sam po sebi kriza kad se navikneš na suburb. Grad je zanimljiv mlađima zbog događanja i izlazaka.
No upravo će ovi što žive po gradovima biti ti koji više neće imati auta u sadašnjem broju, nego koristiti AI servise za prijevoz.
Last edited by Hektorović on 19/2/2023, 21:08; edited 1 time in total
Hektorović- Posts : 26371
2018-04-10
Re: Ipak izglasana zabrana benzinaca i dizelaša
pa i ja odem s autom do splita i nazad bez punjenja.
benzinskim.
imam dva takva
ali zato zašparam mjesečno oko 400 eura min. na tome što do birtije, dućana, škole, vrtića i posla idem na struju
benzinskim.
imam dva takva
ali zato zašparam mjesečno oko 400 eura min. na tome što do birtije, dućana, škole, vrtića i posla idem na struju
_________________
marcellus- Posts : 45728
2014-04-16
Re: Ipak izglasana zabrana benzinaca i dizelaša
nakon štutgarta u sport modu troši oko 40l. znači da mi je doseg 150km.marcellus wrote:veber wrote:osim mog tehcentruma nikog ne boli kuatzmarcellus wrote:
kog boli kurac kolko kw ima tvoj auto
u vožnji troši 10-15 kw/h na 100 km
moj benzinac koliko troši kW? daj me prosvjetli.
mislim da ima 300kW
daj mi natipkaj koliko troši kWh dok idem za HR?
pretvori u ampere.
možeš i u litre benzina.
i dalje računam u kalorijama pa mi možeš i u kalorijama.
brkaš snagu s potrošnjom.
govorim ti kolko moj auto troši.
tvoj vjerojatno (neovisno o max snazi motora) troši na otvorenoj cesti oko 8-9 litara ak se ne naganjaš ko konj, ako da onda 20
u kilovat satima, ekvivalent je 100 kwh na sto km za neku srednju tvoju potrošnju
što je je li jedno pet puta više nego što potroši električar, u kilovatima, zbog lošijeg iskorištenja goriva (većina ode na grijanje zraka)
stanem na pumpu, natočim, čekam u redu i za 10min je sve gotovo.
kada iskopčam 4 cilindra troši nikaj. u austriji sam ga imao na 5.
nema električara koji to može napraviti.
a pogotovo ne dizelaš. ti troše nikaj. i natankiraš ih za 10 minuta kao i benzinca
i napraviš 1500km ako ti je noga teška.
ti si popušio foru koju ćeš skupo platiti
_________________
smrt baterijama sloboda Dizelu.
veber-
Posts : 53319
2014-12-30
Re: Ipak izglasana zabrana benzinaca i dizelaša
Btw, mislim da se je Rimac zaletio sa onim Robotaxijima. Još smo 10-tak godina prerano.
Investors go back to basics with simpler self-driving vehicles
An autonomous ‘Auto-Pod’ vehicle is seen inside the Aurrigo factory in Coventry, Britain. — Reuters
COVENTRY (Britain): Developing fully autonomous vehicles (AVs) that can go everywhere has proven harder and more expensive than expected, but investors are continuing to fund startups that target simpler self-driving vehicle solutions far removed from pedestrians and other vehicles operated by unpredictable humans.
British AV software company Oxbotica, Sweden’s Einride, America’s Outrider and British supplier Aurrigo International Plc are among number of companies drawing investor interest with more focused approaches, aimed at smaller, simpler customer segments – from mining vehicles to tractors or forklifts.
After watching robotaxi firms spend billions on technology that could still be many years away, investors are looking for startups that burn less cash and are preferably already generating revenue, said Kasper Sage, managing partner at BMW’s venture capital fund BMW iVentures, which led autonomous forklift company Fox Robotics’ US$20 million funding round in October.
“Full autonomy in every kind of environment is still years, if not decades out,” Sage said. “You need to have a business case that works and you need to make the problem smaller.”
Earlier promises made by robotaxi companies of operating fleets of vehicles by the early 2020s have fallen well short.
When Ford Motor Co and Volkswagen AG pulled the plug on self-driving unit Argo AI in November, Ford CEO Jim Farley said a profitable robotaxi business was still many years away.
Ford rival General Motors Co burned through nearly US$2 billion last year at its robotaxi unit Cruise and said it anticipates spending even more in 2023.
The problem is that making robot cars that can drive more safely than people is immensely tough. This is because AV systems still lack humans’ ability to predict and assess risk quickly, especially when encountering unexpected incidents.
When it became clear that the era of robotaxis was still distant, investors in 2021 shifted instead to self-driving truck companies that promised a faster route to market by hauling freight autonomously – arguing it would be easier to develop AVs to operate on highways at high speed without pedestrians.
But those startups have also struggled to deliver because a robot driving fast still cannot match the human brain.
AV truck technology firm Aurora, for instance, has a market value of US$2 billion, a fraction of the US$12.5 billion when it went public in 2021 via a special-purpose acquisition company.
Keeping it simple
Faced with the long-term conundrum that people and robots do not mix well, investors have gone back to basics, targeting less-complex, less cash-intensive forms of autonomy with a clearer path to payback, operating at lower speeds with little to no traffic.
BMW iVentures has also invested in AV truck technology firm Kodiak Robotics, which managing partner Sage said has adopted a simpler approach to areas like mapping.
In October, Kodiak won a US$50 million contract to develop AVs for the US Army.
“It helps that we’re not spending a ton of money, like some folks have,” said Kodiak CEO Don Burnette.
Overall venture investment in AV companies in the fourth quarter plunged 47% to $1.4 billion from a year earlier, according to PitchBook senior analyst Jonathan Geurkink.
But US$500 million of that went to AV electric truck firm Einride, which is working towards running self-driving trucks on public roads but has focused first on less-crowded private roads at logistics and manufacturing hubs of customers like GE Appliances, a unit of Chinese home appliance maker Haier.
“The shift in investment … toward off-road/more structured environments is a very real one given the lack of progress in passenger AVs (and) the high capital requirements involved,” said Asad Hussain, research partner at private equity firm Mobility Impact Partners.
‘Somewhere, not everywhere’
Last month, British AV software startup Oxbotica announced US$140 million in funding to roll out more products, starting with AVs operating in mines and remote areas.
“We’re really focused on ‘somewhere’ autonomy rather than ‘everywhere’ autonomy because that’s where the value is today,” Oxbotica CEO Gavin Jackson said.
Jamie Vollbracht, founding partner of Kiko Ventures, IP Group Plc’s US$450 million clean-tech investment platform, said mining companies can lose millions of dollars per hour in remote areas if they cannot get a human driver into a truck, placing them among a growing number of viable markets for AVs. Kiko was Oxbotica’s first institutional investor.
“There has been a major underestimation of the scale of those early (AV) applications,” Vollbracht said.
US startup Outrider in January announced US$73 million in funding to scale up its self-driving trucks that currently operate at low speeds in customers’ distribution yards.
Construction and agricultural equipment – used off-road in low-traffic environments – has been another growth area for AV startups. They are operating alongside traditional heavy equipment makers like Caterpillar Inc, Deere & Co and CNH Industrial NV, which have also invested in AV technology.
Like Oxbotica, Apex.AI designs AV software for use in a variety of vehicles for “a number of non-automotive and trucking customers (with) a wide range of applications,” said CEO Jan Becker.
US agricultural equipment maker AGCO Corp, for instance, is using the Palo Alto, California-based startup’s software for an experimental automated electric planter.
Deere has already acquired a number of AV-related businesses as it moves towards autonomy, including self-driving tractor firm Bear Flag Robotics for US$250 million in 2021.
San Francisco-based Trucks Venture Capital had invested in Bear Flag before its sale and managing partner Reilly Brennan said the firm is “actively looking for another autonomous ag (startup).”
Trucks Venture Capital has also invested in Teleo, a maker of semi-autonomous retrofits for heavy construction and mining equipment that announced US$12 million in funding last June.
Teleo’s system allows a human operator to control multiple slow-moving AVs remotely and to take over only in situations that the software cannot handle.
CEO Vinay Shet said combining the best of AV software and the human brain allowed Teleo to “build a real product that we can take to market today and not wait for another decade or two.”
Investors go back to basics with simpler self-driving vehicles
An autonomous ‘Auto-Pod’ vehicle is seen inside the Aurrigo factory in Coventry, Britain. — Reuters
COVENTRY (Britain): Developing fully autonomous vehicles (AVs) that can go everywhere has proven harder and more expensive than expected, but investors are continuing to fund startups that target simpler self-driving vehicle solutions far removed from pedestrians and other vehicles operated by unpredictable humans.
British AV software company Oxbotica, Sweden’s Einride, America’s Outrider and British supplier Aurrigo International Plc are among number of companies drawing investor interest with more focused approaches, aimed at smaller, simpler customer segments – from mining vehicles to tractors or forklifts.
After watching robotaxi firms spend billions on technology that could still be many years away, investors are looking for startups that burn less cash and are preferably already generating revenue, said Kasper Sage, managing partner at BMW’s venture capital fund BMW iVentures, which led autonomous forklift company Fox Robotics’ US$20 million funding round in October.
“Full autonomy in every kind of environment is still years, if not decades out,” Sage said. “You need to have a business case that works and you need to make the problem smaller.”
Earlier promises made by robotaxi companies of operating fleets of vehicles by the early 2020s have fallen well short.
When Ford Motor Co and Volkswagen AG pulled the plug on self-driving unit Argo AI in November, Ford CEO Jim Farley said a profitable robotaxi business was still many years away.
Ford rival General Motors Co burned through nearly US$2 billion last year at its robotaxi unit Cruise and said it anticipates spending even more in 2023.
The problem is that making robot cars that can drive more safely than people is immensely tough. This is because AV systems still lack humans’ ability to predict and assess risk quickly, especially when encountering unexpected incidents.
When it became clear that the era of robotaxis was still distant, investors in 2021 shifted instead to self-driving truck companies that promised a faster route to market by hauling freight autonomously – arguing it would be easier to develop AVs to operate on highways at high speed without pedestrians.
But those startups have also struggled to deliver because a robot driving fast still cannot match the human brain.
AV truck technology firm Aurora, for instance, has a market value of US$2 billion, a fraction of the US$12.5 billion when it went public in 2021 via a special-purpose acquisition company.
Keeping it simple
Faced with the long-term conundrum that people and robots do not mix well, investors have gone back to basics, targeting less-complex, less cash-intensive forms of autonomy with a clearer path to payback, operating at lower speeds with little to no traffic.
BMW iVentures has also invested in AV truck technology firm Kodiak Robotics, which managing partner Sage said has adopted a simpler approach to areas like mapping.
In October, Kodiak won a US$50 million contract to develop AVs for the US Army.
“It helps that we’re not spending a ton of money, like some folks have,” said Kodiak CEO Don Burnette.
Overall venture investment in AV companies in the fourth quarter plunged 47% to $1.4 billion from a year earlier, according to PitchBook senior analyst Jonathan Geurkink.
But US$500 million of that went to AV electric truck firm Einride, which is working towards running self-driving trucks on public roads but has focused first on less-crowded private roads at logistics and manufacturing hubs of customers like GE Appliances, a unit of Chinese home appliance maker Haier.
“The shift in investment … toward off-road/more structured environments is a very real one given the lack of progress in passenger AVs (and) the high capital requirements involved,” said Asad Hussain, research partner at private equity firm Mobility Impact Partners.
‘Somewhere, not everywhere’
Last month, British AV software startup Oxbotica announced US$140 million in funding to roll out more products, starting with AVs operating in mines and remote areas.
“We’re really focused on ‘somewhere’ autonomy rather than ‘everywhere’ autonomy because that’s where the value is today,” Oxbotica CEO Gavin Jackson said.
Jamie Vollbracht, founding partner of Kiko Ventures, IP Group Plc’s US$450 million clean-tech investment platform, said mining companies can lose millions of dollars per hour in remote areas if they cannot get a human driver into a truck, placing them among a growing number of viable markets for AVs. Kiko was Oxbotica’s first institutional investor.
“There has been a major underestimation of the scale of those early (AV) applications,” Vollbracht said.
US startup Outrider in January announced US$73 million in funding to scale up its self-driving trucks that currently operate at low speeds in customers’ distribution yards.
Construction and agricultural equipment – used off-road in low-traffic environments – has been another growth area for AV startups. They are operating alongside traditional heavy equipment makers like Caterpillar Inc, Deere & Co and CNH Industrial NV, which have also invested in AV technology.
Like Oxbotica, Apex.AI designs AV software for use in a variety of vehicles for “a number of non-automotive and trucking customers (with) a wide range of applications,” said CEO Jan Becker.
US agricultural equipment maker AGCO Corp, for instance, is using the Palo Alto, California-based startup’s software for an experimental automated electric planter.
Deere has already acquired a number of AV-related businesses as it moves towards autonomy, including self-driving tractor firm Bear Flag Robotics for US$250 million in 2021.
San Francisco-based Trucks Venture Capital had invested in Bear Flag before its sale and managing partner Reilly Brennan said the firm is “actively looking for another autonomous ag (startup).”
Trucks Venture Capital has also invested in Teleo, a maker of semi-autonomous retrofits for heavy construction and mining equipment that announced US$12 million in funding last June.
Teleo’s system allows a human operator to control multiple slow-moving AVs remotely and to take over only in situations that the software cannot handle.
CEO Vinay Shet said combining the best of AV software and the human brain allowed Teleo to “build a real product that we can take to market today and not wait for another decade or two.”
Hektorović- Posts : 26371
2018-04-10
Re: Ipak izglasana zabrana benzinaca i dizelaša
nemreš sa svojim benzincima rute koje sam napisao.marcellus wrote:pa i ja odem s autom do splita i nazad bez punjenja.
benzinskim.
imam dva takva
ali zato zašparam mjesečno oko 400 eura min. na tome što do birtije, dućana, škole, vrtića i posla idem na struju
i lako napravimo forumski test.
kada budem u hr odemo posjetiti ambru.
ja bum ga imao u sport modu ti zemi mazdu.
da bi bili ravnopravni na 180 ću ga prešaltati u 4u.
400€ su spike za djecu.
ti ne radiš 50 000km/g
uvjerio si sebe da hoćeš strujića i to si napravio.
loša odluka, ali mlad si za deset godina buš skužio da si se sjebao i od dijagrama buš kupil auto.
_________________
smrt baterijama sloboda Dizelu.
veber-
Posts : 53319
2014-12-30
Re: Ipak izglasana zabrana benzinaca i dizelaša
malo sam surfal.
ima tu konja pod haubom.
ima i momenta.
i ubrzanja
i potrošnje-lažu
i automatkih getriba-lažu
sve u svemu, jebo strujića. kćerin scenic odere bilo koji marcov auto s tri vreće cementa.
ima tu konja pod haubom.
ima i momenta.
i ubrzanja
i potrošnje-lažu
i automatkih getriba-lažu
sve u svemu, jebo strujića. kćerin scenic odere bilo koji marcov auto s tri vreće cementa.
_________________
smrt baterijama sloboda Dizelu.
veber-
Posts : 53319
2014-12-30
Re: Ipak izglasana zabrana benzinaca i dizelaša
pa dobro, kakav je to autic, nije valjda na tri kotacaveber wrote:malo sam surfal.
ima tu konja pod haubom.
ima i momenta.
i ubrzanja
i potrošnje-lažu
i automatkih getriba-lažu
sve u svemu, jebo strujića. kćerin scenic odere bilo koji marcov auto s tri vreće cementa.
stavi sliku da vidimo
dijagram-
Posts : 18695
2015-08-09
Re: Ipak izglasana zabrana benzinaca i dizelaša
dijagram wrote:Sam si rekao da je jeftiniji i taj uzimas.crvenkasti wrote:dijagram wrote:jos o auticima, do kad vise.
evo i ja cu, prekjucer produzio registraciju.
ide na dizel i nije bijeli ko crvenkov
malo sam ga omuljao kod city centra i dok se susio maznuo dvije lavazze
stize proljece uskoro cu ljetne gume kupiti
tako, mali doprinos temi:)
Otkud ti znaš koje je moj boje?
I da bolje vuce nego plavi, crni ili crveni.
To je bilo prije više od godine dana. Ja sam već zaboravio zašto je bijel.
crvenkasti-
Posts : 28714
2014-04-17
Re: Ipak izglasana zabrana benzinaca i dizelaša
ček kaj oš od kćeri fotke ili moje?dijagram wrote:pa dobro, kakav je to autic, nije valjda na tri kotacaveber wrote:malo sam surfal.
ima tu konja pod haubom.
ima i momenta.
i ubrzanja
i potrošnje-lažu
i automatkih getriba-lažu
sve u svemu, jebo strujića. kćerin scenic odere bilo koji marcov auto s tri vreće cementa.
stavi sliku da vidimo
_________________
smrt baterijama sloboda Dizelu.
veber-
Posts : 53319
2014-12-30
Re: Ipak izglasana zabrana benzinaca i dizelaša
ma marcelov autic koji kritizirate kako nista ne valjaveber wrote:ček kaj oš od kćeri fotke ili moje?dijagram wrote:pa dobro, kakav je to autic, nije valjda na tri kotacaveber wrote:malo sam surfal.
ima tu konja pod haubom.
ima i momenta.
i ubrzanja
i potrošnje-lažu
i automatkih getriba-lažu
sve u svemu, jebo strujića. kćerin scenic odere bilo koji marcov auto s tri vreće cementa.
stavi sliku da vidimo
dijagram-
Posts : 18695
2015-08-09
Re: Ipak izglasana zabrana benzinaca i dizelaša
ne trebaš množinudijagram wrote:ma marcelov autic koji kritizirate kako nista ne valjaveber wrote:ček kaj oš od kćeri fotke ili moje?dijagram wrote:pa dobro, kakav je to autic, nije valjda na tri kotacaveber wrote:malo sam surfal.
ima tu konja pod haubom.
ima i momenta.
i ubrzanja
i potrošnje-lažu
i automatkih getriba-lažu
sve u svemu, jebo strujića. kćerin scenic odere bilo koji marcov auto s tri vreće cementa.
stavi sliku da vidimo
do sada ga samo ja kritiziral.
auto.
on je stavljaj neke selfije.
govno je govno. bilo tko od nas da stavi sliku.
_________________
smrt baterijama sloboda Dizelu.
veber-
Posts : 53319
2014-12-30
Re: Ipak izglasana zabrana benzinaca i dizelaša
malo me muči ušteda od 400€
na gorivu
kaj vozi helikopter?
komercijalni ne gutaju 100l/h
od kuda ušteda 400€/mj.
koliko lik radi kilometara?
ili kaj vozi?
na gorivu
kaj vozi helikopter?
komercijalni ne gutaju 100l/h
od kuda ušteda 400€/mj.
koliko lik radi kilometara?
ili kaj vozi?
_________________
smrt baterijama sloboda Dizelu.
veber-
Posts : 53319
2014-12-30
Re: Ipak izglasana zabrana benzinaca i dizelaša
Jedan jako dobar Kinez kojem europski EV ne mogu konkurirati
Hektorović- Posts : 26371
2018-04-10
Re: Ipak izglasana zabrana benzinaca i dizelaša
ja sam već uštedio soma eura na benzinu do sad, a imam ga dva mjeseca.veber wrote:
ti si popušio foru koju ćeš skupo platiti
je, jako skupo.
_________________
marcellus- Posts : 45728
2014-04-16
Re: Ipak izglasana zabrana benzinaca i dizelaša
veber wrote:malo me muči ušteda od 400€
na gorivu
kaj vozi helikopter?
komercijalni ne gutaju 100l/h
od kuda ušteda 400€/mj.
koliko lik radi kilometara?
ili kaj vozi?
radim 3-4.000 km mjesečno po gradu.
Auto mi već ima preko 5.000 na cajgeru, nakon niti 50 dana što je kod mene. To je 100 km dnevno u prosjeku. Samo grad i okolica.
benzinac mi troši 8 litara, po gradu kad su gužve i preko 10 (jer voziš u prvoj i prosječna brzina je oko 10 kmh, sat vremena mi je bilo od svetica do kustošije a to je 10 km)
benzin je 1,41 eura.
to je nekih 13 eura na sto km, ako izbjegnem prevelike gužve.
13 * 35 = 455 eura
to je bio moj mjesečni trošak za benzin.
Struja - noćno punjenje - trošak između 0,8 i 1 eura na sto km (ovisi od temperature najviše, strujaš ima regeneraciju pri kočenju pa ga ne jebu gradske gužve toliko)
nek je i 1 euro, a nije, na 100 km, to je i dalje 35 eura mjesečno
razlika 420 eura
_________________
marcellus- Posts : 45728
2014-04-16
Re: Ipak izglasana zabrana benzinaca i dizelaša
veber wrote:malo sam surfal.
ima tu konja pod haubom.
ima i momenta.
i ubrzanja
i potrošnje-lažu
i automatkih getriba-lažu
sve u svemu, jebo strujića. kćerin scenic odere bilo koji marcov auto s tri vreće cementa.
to sigurno.
samo meni ne treba taj auto za oderat nekog na semaforu, za to imam drugi auto.
meni treba taj auto kao shopping cart / trolley / linija do posla
_________________
marcellus- Posts : 45728
2014-04-16
Re: Ipak izglasana zabrana benzinaca i dizelaša
inače ti samo surfaj, ja se vozim dok ti surfaš. Praktički badava.
radije ja popijem svoje nofce neg da mi ih auto popije.
radije ja popijem svoje nofce neg da mi ih auto popije.
_________________
marcellus- Posts : 45728
2014-04-16
Re: Ipak izglasana zabrana benzinaca i dizelaša
računao sam na bazi 3500 km mjesečno jer sam toliko točno prešao u prvih mjesec dana s autom.
Možda ubuduće bude malo manje, ali neće bit manje od 3000 mjesečno
zavisi i kako će se kretati cijene benzina, uglavnom tu negdje oko 400 eura mjesečno je ušteda, dvajst eura gore dolje.
na godišnjoj razini to je skoro 5 k eura
auto je jeftilen i isplatit će se kad računaš i uštedu na servisima i registraciji za nešto više od 2 godine. Oko dvije i pol.
Možda ubuduće bude malo manje, ali neće bit manje od 3000 mjesečno
zavisi i kako će se kretati cijene benzina, uglavnom tu negdje oko 400 eura mjesečno je ušteda, dvajst eura gore dolje.
na godišnjoj razini to je skoro 5 k eura
auto je jeftilen i isplatit će se kad računaš i uštedu na servisima i registraciji za nešto više od 2 godine. Oko dvije i pol.
_________________
marcellus- Posts : 45728
2014-04-16
Re: Ipak izglasana zabrana benzinaca i dizelaša
dakle nakon toga mi je vratio svoju cijenu, sve preko toga sam na čistom profitu
_________________
marcellus- Posts : 45728
2014-04-16
Re: Ipak izglasana zabrana benzinaca i dizelaša
dijagram wrote:ma marcelov autic koji kritizirate kako nista ne valjaveber wrote:ček kaj oš od kćeri fotke ili moje?dijagram wrote:pa dobro, kakav je to autic, nije valjda na tri kotacaveber wrote:malo sam surfal.
ima tu konja pod haubom.
ima i momenta.
i ubrzanja
i potrošnje-lažu
i automatkih getriba-lažu
sve u svemu, jebo strujića. kćerin scenic odere bilo koji marcov auto s tri vreće cementa.
stavi sliku da vidimo
joj znaš koje aute imam. Starog focusa, mx 5 nc, i električnog springa.
spring je za okokuće
mx 5 je za zajebanciju
focus je rezerva, ako ustrebam negdje ić a autić je kod žene ili obratno
za putovat je ryan air
_________________
marcellus- Posts : 45728
2014-04-16
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